Trump and May meeting

  • So I understand that the lovely and talented leaders of the UK and the USA will be having a meeting next week. As well as purchasing a copy of American Idiot by Green Day , what should I look out for in this meeting? I don't get much UK news here, though what is clear to me is that both parties are desperate for a trade deal. Trump has pissed off half the world with his new tarriffs :cursing:, and May is looking for anyone to develop more trade with to make Brexit appear more palatable. :/.
    I do hear a lot of rumors that healthcare could be part of this. It feels like my entire lifetime that people have been crying out the the NHS has been slowly being privatized, but it does seem to be increasing in recent years.

    So, what might happen? And what other protests are going on?

  • I'm not that bothered about Trump -- he's a whole lot better than Clinton would have been and nowhere near as bad as Bush was.


    Considering some of the unsavoury characters we have welcomed here, I find this mass protesting all a bit farcical.


    The other thing I find farcical is the way the left are trying to pin things on him that he isn't guilty of -- I get it that he's a climate change denier and a bit of a knob, but half the protests are about stuff that either isn't true or presented out of context.

    I want to see this...

    https://www.crowdfunder.co.uk/…alloon-to-fly-over-london

    :D

  • Whereas cg I can appreciate your second point,I do find the first point very insulting and offensive and very close to overstepping the mark. There is enough racial hatred in the world without your racist imput.




    I

  • The so-called "muslim ban" was on specific parts of the middle east where Isis were operating, and didn't include Islamic countries like Indonesia, Malaysia etc.


    I think acknowledging problems with Islam as it's practiced in some areas doesn't mean you "dislike" all muslims in general -- perpetuating this idea that it's merely irrational Islamophobia isn't helpful on either side of the argument.


    Trump is not a politician, as in he throws ideas out there without thinking them through, and he often lands himself in hot water about them -- he has knee-jerk reactions that are badly thought out, but that doesn't make him the next Hitler.

    I do find the first point very insulting and offensive and very close to overstepping the mark

    Yes I agree, but for the large part I'd rather it visible and unsanitised for everyone to make their own judgements - just so long as we don't get overrun with racism or other behaviour that makes this an unsafe place for anyone who happens to follow that path.

  • I must be honest and say that 'yes', i do dislike muslims in general, unless they're living in a muslim country!

    I'm living in Catalonia at the moment, yet it could be the middle east! It's awful.


    I have my views Paul and you have yours. Some people eat meat, some smoke, some do crosswords! We all have an opinion.

  • I have my views Paul and you have yours. Some people eat meat, some smoke, some do crosswords! We all have an opinion.

    It's not about opinion it's about presentation -- if you refer to muslims as "muslimes" then you're being unnecessarily insulting.

    Stereotyping all the members of a particular faith as the same, and using that as a justification for hatred, then it's in the same league as racism, homophobia, sexism and pretty much every other prejudice.

  • Indeed,we all have our own opinions and sometimes they will be well away from what others think,but as an intelligent adult,one should be able to realize when it is a bad moment to share those opinions. If it is likely to hurt or offend a lot of people of a certain a faith,race,colour or belief (to name just a few) , then it is best not to say it.


    Paul hit the proverbial nail on the head with using the word -


    Presentation


    Words can be very dangerous and hurtful,so use them carefully and use them well.


    I know that many will say -sticks and stones may break my bones but names will never hurt me. Very rarely is that true !!

  • Some of the highlights of why people are so anti-Trump:

    He is unapologetically misogynistic

    Pulled the US out of the Paris Climate Accord

    Pulled the US out of the UN Council on Human Rights

    Selling off National Park land for mining rights

    He is more friendly with Russia and North Korea than with most traditional allies

    Systematic failure to help Puerto Rico recover from the Hurricane damage

    The children-in-cages debacle

    He has started a trade war that will not only increase prices for many goods and services across the world, but also reduce American jobs

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  • One conspiracy theory that I have heard is that Trump's trade disputes in Europe are part of a wider strategy to get a better post-Brexit deal with the UK. This theory also talked about a "capitalist coup" whereby May will be ousted in favour of Rees-Mogg, and the failure to get decent Brexit deals become such that mass influx of US businesses to the UK seems like a life-saving opportunity.


    Of course it's just a conspiracy theory.....

  • I am not anti trump as I do not give him the time that he would like me to,though from the few things I have heard from him,I must admit that I do find him to be a complete prick !!!!

  • I don't think he should be coming - the separation of Mexican children and parents has a worrying similarity to some (of the slightly less appalling) actions taken in Nazi Germany.


    I shiver at his obvious misogynistic attitudes.


    I can only wonder that the choices of Hilary Clinton and Donald Trump were apparently the best choices for presidential candidates that the US were able to muster.

  • Im getting the vibe that TM has slinked out of the hard brexit in direct response to being overlooked by Trump who is still pissed off at being manipulated over the novichok thing and is admonishing little britain in the way that superpowers can.


    He is a self proclaimed (wheeler)dealer and he is working it well and to the advantage of international investors.


    Looks like TM has been spanked.


    What a shame. She did propose some quite fair changes that have continually been undermined by financial profiteers.

  • TM caves on brexit and Trump comes whipping in at massive cost to local, underfunded, police forces.....


    Desert nation.....subjugated by Trump the 'dealmaker'.....the juxtaposition of this guy arriving in the week that brexit fails is pure assertion of power over loser, desert nation.

  • That's interesting - I didn't know that. I was thinking about the children were separated from their mothers on arrival at concentration camps.

    This is why I find it hard to be 100% anti-Trump -- there's a lot he gets wrong and he certainly puts his mouth into gear way too quickly, but the US liberal left love finding things to blame him for that weren't necessarily his doing.

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  • That's a very fair point Paul, only the other day I read a story claiming he has dropped the ban on importing ivory to the US - I have not been able to find any corroboration at all (the US being part of the convention on banning ivory).


    Trump is certainly not my cup of tea, but he did get voted in....

  • That's a very fair point Paul, only the other day I read a story claiming he has dropped the ban on importing ivory to the US - I have not been able to find any corroboration at all (the US being part of the convention on banning ivory).

    I think it's true, but Trump was personally against the decision and referred to hunting as a "horror show". I believe (without looking it up) that he tried to overturn the plan but was defeated.

  • It's not about opinion it's about presentation -- if you refer to muslims as "muslimes" then you're being unnecessarily insulting.

    Stereotyping all the members of a particular faith as the same, and using that as a justification for hatred, then it's in the same league as racism, homophobia, sexism and pretty much every other prejudice.

    Obviously I must be racist, homophobic, and sexist then! Plus all the others, bless their souls!

  • Well some interesting views. firstly to ConstantGarde, yes, everyone is entitled to their own views etc, but I do find your dislike of Muslims in general quite disturbing. On an individual basis I have met some beautiful, amazing, caring people of that faith, I have met some beautiful, caring Christians, same with Jewish people. I dont give two figs what religion,race, creed, culture someone is from, it's a person as an individual that matters. Wiping out a whole movement of people just because they are Muslim flies in the face of what humanity and benevolence stands for. So if someone knocked on your door who was cold wet and hungry and they were a Muslim, would you refuse them human kindness and compassion, if so that's bigotry.


    Whatever the leaders of the U.S and the U.K do behind closed doors is beyond our control, they will do what they will do. I have no faith in Trump to do anything involving humanity and doing things for the higher good, he is part of the machine that is going to make things even more wrong than it already is. He was voted in but the American public who voted for him were highly duped, I truly believe he was a plant from powers that reside way above the realms of open public politics, some part of a grand scheme by those who really run the show behind the scenes, so much so you can almost see the strings attached to his head and limbs that the puppeteers operate him by. I do believe there is a grand plan to shake and push society to breaking point so they can then implement even more rigourous divide and rule tactics. All western governments are shit scared of a public uprising ( in fact it's their biggest fear) and they will do all they can to prevent it and that means implementing even more harsh laws and parameters of living to keep people subdued and chained to the system so their agenda's for society keeps on rolling along. They need us more than we need them but unfortunatley the people who vote for the likes of Trump are as blind as a bat to the fact.

  • Whatever the leaders of the U.S and the U.K do behind closed doors is beyond our control, they will do what they will do. I have no faith in Trump to do anything involving humanity and doing things for the higher good, he is part of the machine that is going to make things even more wrong than it already is. He was voted in but the American public who voted for him were highly duped, I truly believe he was a plant from powers that reside way above the realms of open public politics, some part of a grand scheme by those who really run the show behind the scenes, so much so you can almost see the strings attached to his head and limbs that the puppeteers operate him by. I do believe there is a grand plan to shake and push society to breaking point so they can then implement even more rigourous divide and rule tactics. All western governments are shit scared of a public uprising ( in fact it's their biggest fear) and they will do all they can to prevent it and that means implementing even more harsh laws and parameters of living to keep people subdued and chained to the system so their agenda's for society keeps on rolling along. They need us more than we need them but unfortunatley the people who vote for the likes of Trump are as blind as a bat to the fact.

    Who else could the US citizens have voted for? out of interest.

  • Susan Sarandon - strong supporter of Bernie


    "Who else could the US citizens have voted for? out of interest."   alices wondernland


    As Wombat up there states there is the option of Bernie Sanders. There is also Al Gore. I saw a recent interview of Gore and he showed an interest in the next election. Do we have to talk ideal? Damage limitations . . . Surely the basic qualification of being a politician is enough improvement (rather than "failed business man / reality star").


    Talking about Gore. Gore Vidal would be perfect. I once read that "Gore Vidal is the best president we never had" (never / impossible: because he is gay). Black, female . . . but there are some areas America won't go, not en masse. Well, now that Gore Vidal is dead the time is ripe. Trump shows that celebrity is all. Zombie movies are at an all time high, and now with Vidal dead, America is ready to turn a blind eye and go all out on the first 'real' Zombie president (Trump doesn't count).

  • Who else could the US citizens have voted for? out of interest.

    To answer as you quoted me A.W, and as Maxal says, Al gore, H.Clinton, Bernie Saunders and of course the ginger golfer. I do feel it was a pre ordained thing and Trump was presented in the way he was and jollied along in the race to the presidency by those behind the scenes in the party he fronts. They probably knew the general public of the lower orders would jump to the rallying cry he was spouting in huge numbers. Americans seem to like big, brash firebrandism and he delivered and appealed. In my mind, Bernie Saunders would have been the one with most common sense and decency who was all about social care and welfare and speaks out about corruption and dodgy dealings and actually knows the machinations of the politics over there whereas Trump has got no more clue than a stick with a headache, although he is a business man albeit with some very bad dealings and major failures to his name, he is not a politician. As in the U.K, there is very little choice in a two party system.

  • Al Gore ~ a leopard that does change his spots to suit the environment.

    Fk Vietnam war in the 1970’s ~ there were less flying bullets in the church back then.


    A decade ago Al Gore released his documentary An Inconvenient Truth. Second only to 9/11 it was the decade’s most significant event in shaping public policy worldwide. To mark the anniversary Gore has released An Inconvenient Sequel which has flopped. The politicians haven’t caught up yet but the public has lost interest in global warming – contrary to forecasts summer still feels like summer and winter still feels like winter. If there had been more scrutiny a decade ago of Gore’s life story we would have saved ourselves a decade of bad policy. Gore has written plenty of books but unlike every other vice presidential candidate in memory there haven’t been any memoirs. Why? Because Gore is politically ashamed of his past.

    Gore’s father was a congressman and then senator for Tennessee for 32 years. His mother was an aide to über-liberal Eleanor Roosevelt. In 1956 Gore’s father lost a bid for the vice-presidential nomination and the family’s fierce ambition was channeled to infant Al. He studied politics and history at Harvard where he was elected student president. He’s confessed to smoking pot and a friend recalled ‘pot stimulated Gore’s imagination. He talked about what he would do as President. Political ambition coursed inside him like an underground river.’

    Like his parents, Gore supported the Democratic Left. At college he described anti-communism as ‘paranoia and a national obsession’ and the US military as ‘fascist.’ In 1970, his father was struggling for re-election to the Senate due to his opposition to the Vietnam War which was still popular in Tennessee. After months of family anguish Gore volunteered for a war he didn’t believe in – his dad still lost but Gore knew one day America would ask ‘did you serve?’ After five months in Vietnam (far from the front line), Gore was discharged early after hearing the call to study religion. A few months into his theological studies he quit, made money in property (courtesy of his dad’s network) and worked as a reporter. Then his dad’s old congressional seat became vacant. Dad had learnt the hard way a lefty in Tennessee now had no future, so Gore campaigned stridently right-wing on everything: pro-life, pro-gun, pro-tobacco, anti-gay and born-again. It was 1976 and he won.


    https://www.spectator.co.uk/20…ient-truth-about-al-gore/


    Not that good a choice.

  • Yikes! I admit, I don't know too much about Al Gore. I'll have a proper look at that link alice. I was thinking mainly of the environmental aspect and a couple of interviews I saw . . .

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