London Canada Goose Store attacked.

  • "Canada Goose remains deeply committed to the responsible use and ethical sourcing of all animal materials in our products


    How is it possible to ethically source the fur of a coyote? No matter what way you look at it the coyote gets killed then skinned for fashion.

  • May they suffer the same fates as their 'ethically sourced' furry victims have in afterlives, if there are any, or suffer payback in this. It's wrong to wish harm on a fellow human but there has to be exceptions for these and certain politicians.


    On a similar note I've noticed of late the amount of bimbos who are sporting bobble hats with the fur bobble.

  • Never heard of them. Reading the news report it wasn't a ram raid it was a moped gang and they broke a window . The apple store and a jewellers were also hit but attacks by these gangs are now a daily occurance and it will probably result in Oxford Street being pedestrianised very soon

  • Wild dogs are routinely killed around sheep stations in Oz. These dogs are Ferrell animals whom like the UK native fox can decimate a flock of sheep. Many sheep can be killed during just one attack and only the smallest, less valuable parts of the animal are utilised by the prey animal. Pregnant Ewes are often chased, worried by Ferrell dogs, resulting in death of the unborn. Pack animals like the Coyotes and Ferrell dogs target ranch/farms and rearing stations and can have a huge impact on a food agri business and some economies. In the case of pest control, some of these predatory hides/skins/fur will be encorporated into the clothing industry.

    Hudson Bay est in England supplied many garments to the early Wild West pioneers/settlers and arctic explorers. Why a housewife from Brixton or Chelsea should need a coat that could save a persons life in the extreme Artic, for going shopping in a London is beyond me.


    The fashion industry is lead by the demands of the high street and although the ongoing pest control of wild and Ferrell animals is inevitable. Hunting/trapping of wild animals and insustrialised farming of animals for fur, purely for high street fashion. Is a crime we all contribute to by example during our lifetime. Some folk who avoid the wearing of any animal products and with that all utilisation of animal byproducts are exemplary in my view.


    However I do condone making full use of any animal that has become a victim of pest control and vintage fashion clothing industry.


    I own a 2nd hand US army M-65 military Parker . I believe the fur hood trim is real fur, although they later used artificial fur for thee coats. I paid £4 for this Parker @ a carboot sale 3 years ago and have no qualms about owning or wearing it. If I were to buy new, I would chose artificial fur trim over animal fur, but the animal that contributed to the making of this garment died for someone’s sins including my own.


    What is evident is the high price these Canada Goose, Hudson Bay coats command on the high street. Which doesn’t reflect the fact real animal fur is used or quality of the garment, but the importance some folk place on garment branding and brand names. Any question of ethics, should lay with the purchaser and not the manufactureror, the farmer orthe trapper.

  • I don't think you can compare dogs (it's feral by the way!) with foxes. To say a fox can decimate a flock of sheep is hysterical nonsense! Sure they may take the odd sickly or weak lamb, burt anything much bigger- no way!

  • I dont think theres any moral justification for trying to rekindle a dying industry (hunting to provide furs for fashion).Theres perfectly good artificial furs indistinguishable from real so why would anyone prefer an animal to die for their own vanity.?

    Ban the sale of wild animal furs the same as the govt plans on banning ivory sales theyll have to change their sales policy or close down.

  • You may think artificial fur is indistinguishable from the real thing. Others don’t. Leather can be replicated. So can fur. Each material holds its own unique properties. Utilising a byproduct (waste) from a exhausted life be that through old age, food production, road kill, pest control shouldn’t just be discarded on the grounds, ‘there’s similar ‘looking’ feeling alternatives.

    Ivory is different in that it’s poached, often cruelly. If elephants were farmed for meat. If Populations needed to be controlled and the Tusk was no more than another byproduct, like walrus tooth, mammoth or animal bone. Therewouldnt be this ban in place, unless it continues to be abused through increased demand. The ivory has unique carving properties, it has a grain the artist/carver works with. Again. There’s no blanket ban on these later materials other than ivory. The ivory ban is intended to safeguard elephants from illegal poaching.

    Eastern medicine being a driving force for many crimes against wild animals runs parallel to the fashion industry when it comes to corruption and greed.


    I agree mass consumption of any natural product will cause decline of species, illegal activities, and sometimes even extinction. Using Leopod skins for Zulu/Christian worship being one example where fake/artificial alternatives can make a huge difference.

    We live in a society where most of our food comes from the shops in the UK. Hunting, harvesting from the wild is relied upon in other parts of the world. In London not so, nor is there a need to have a real fur trim to keep a person alive during our worst winter weather.

  • I don't think you can compare dogs (it's feral by the way!) with foxes. To say a fox can decimate a flock of sheep is hysterical nonsense! Sure they may take the odd sickly or weak lamb, burt anything much bigger- no way!

    I’ve worked on pig farms where the fox would jump over the single strand electric fence many many times during the night. Each time killing and carrying off a piglet. Discarding the piglets off site before returning for more. A fox will kill every chicken in a pen and yet eat only its fill. A fox will do the same with lambs. Size is relevant to the predictor even if they hunt in packs.

    A farmer only needs to loose a few too many lambs for his ‘flock’ to be decimated. How’s that nonesense?

  • I'm guessing the Coyote was there before farmers settled.Same as Dingo's! If you're going to settle in places such as this,then be prepared for your livestock to be sitting ducks.Maybe its up to the farmer to erect the appropriate fencing and protection (As in secure shelters)before using other methods.Not cheap,but its unfair I think to discriminate against animals just following their instinct.I'm well aware of dingo fencing and the issues.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dingo_Fence

  • I'm guessing the Coyote was there before farmers settled.Same as Dingo's! If you're going to settle in places such as this,then be prepared for your livestock to be sitting ducks.Maybe its up to the farmer to erect the appropriate fencing and protection (As in secure shelters)before using other methods.Not cheap,but its unfair I think to discriminate against animals just following their instinct.I'm well aware of dingo fencing and the issues.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dingo_Fence

    indeed and the fox too.

    Farmers do what is practically possible to safeguard their investment. I come from a long line of hunter/poacher folk. Every village Ive ever lived in, in the UK, I seem to get to know the locals who make it their mission to singlehandedly exterminate any fox that isn’t just passing through. By doing this, the fox doesn’t get established and learn to take advantage where the easy food is. A fox is a creature of habit and won’t easily be stopped by most fences, unless erected high, buried deep and electrified.

    I have a mate who keeps chickens and for years he has a set baited fox trap next to his chicken pens.

    Most years in the UK there is a blooming rabbit population that becomes easy food for the fox with regular outbreaks of myxomatosis, rendering the wild rabbits blind and easy prey.


    I know of one lad spent a year in oz working on the dingo fence. His job was to just go round the fence line and maintain/repair any weak spots. He had the brainwave to plant out cannabis along the entire route and this he harvested before heading to Sydney at the end of his working holiday.


    I’m dismayed at America’s lifting of elephant products ban. I can’t say I understand the real situation on the ground in Africa or the politics behind conservation. I do know that very rich American hunters will be offered hunting experiences at extremely high costs. This tourist income will be syphoned off, to make a few organisations richer and may pay for more rangers to protect the remaining wildlife from illegal poaching, but to me it sends out the wrong message.


    I had a mate from the UK who would holiday in Africa and regularly pay to go on safari and to hunt. Once when he was drunk, he told me how it was more fun to shoot Baboons than it was to shoot blacks? He explained that blacks would run away, where baboons would sit in a line ontop of a fence. He would shoot one and when it fell to the floor the other baboons would continue to just sit on the fence.

  • That's the farmers fault for not having them properly fenced in at night..

    that’s a fair point, however the fencing system I was installing allowed for outdoor pig rearing. I would hate to think that pigs continued to be confined to a small indoor space, in a artificially lit environment for half of their short lives.

    Strangely enough on one of the outdoor pig farms I was erecting a fence. The farmer was trying to shoot the magpies. One magpie realised that if it flew down and sat on the back of a outdoor pig. If the magpie pecked at a scab on the pigs back. It would get a free drink of pigs blood. Day after day the magpie would fly onto the same pig and peck at the same scab. Other magpies watching soon started to copy this magpie. Even in nature animals are looking for easy pickings.

  • This quote from the book "Old MacDonalds Factory Farm" sums it up for me...


  • I'd be very surprised if plants survived living unwatered out in the nulla nulla! I had enough problems trying to keep stuff alive in my back yard,with running water! Sorry Alice,I'm finding that story a little hard to believe.Dingo fencing is usually out in the sticks,which is drought stricken most of the time.

  • It’s true. I didn’t mean he just set seeds and went round at the end of the year to harvest. He managed to grow a crop around the fence line of the farm he worked for periodically watering I assume as he went and it wasn’t the last time by the sounds of it. I have no idea how many days it took to drive the farm circuit or how many times a week he would pass each plant if any. He married an oz lass, but shortly after they returned to the Uk his new wife wasn’t allowed to stay in the UK. last I saw of him was at his wedding reception.

    Drought resistant, low maintenance cannabis strains have been available for years, long before the explosion of hybrid hydroponic strains became popular. Some folk can’t grow weed in a glass house with every service available. There’s areas in India, Morocco Mexico that barely recieve rainfall throughout the year where cannabis strains have been cultivated from.

    My mums family in oz had a boundary fence that was over 3 hours offroad drive to get to from the homestead. Even then it resembled no-mans Land beyond the fence, according to my mother.

  • This quote from the book "Old MacDonalds Factory Farm" sums it up for me...

    One bit it misses out - https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4388096/


    How we have managed to greatly contribute to antibiotic resistance through the food chain.

    I'm not sure if this mentions spraying fruit crops with them to kill off bacteria, remember reading that somewhere.

  • I’ve worked on pig farms where the fox would jump over the single strand electric fence many many times during the night. Each time killing and carrying off a piglet. Discarding the piglets off site before returning for more. A fox will kill every chicken in a pen and yet eat only its fill. A fox will do the same with lambs. Size is relevant to the predictor even if they hunt in packs.

    A farmer only needs to loose a few too many lambs for his ‘flock’ to be decimated. How’s that nonesense?

    Hello Sir,

    The farmer is to blame if he can't protect his animals properly! And there is a big difference between carrying a tiny piglet away, and 'decimating' a whole flock of sheep! If a fox gets into a chicken coop, the panic of the chickens overexcites a fox, and ends up as carnage. Again, it is the farmers fault for not providing safe housing!

    I think that's probably why someone said you talked nonsense, because it is!

  • Hello Sir,

    The farmer is to blame if he can't protect his animals properly! And there is a big difference between carrying a tiny piglet away, and 'decimating' a whole flock of sheep! If a fox gets into a chicken coop, the panic of the chickens overexcites a fox, and ends up as carnage. Again, it is the farmers fault for not providing safe housing!

    I think that's probably why someone said you talked nonsense, because it is!

    wow thanks for your insight. When I said decimate a whole flock of sheep. I don’t mean literally in one night. (Like the farmer turns up one morning and every sheep is dead In the field) A herd takes years to build up. A fox can easily kill one or two lambs a night. 7 to 14 lambs a week. Piglets just the same. On the pig pens where I erected the electric fence, the pigs were behind low stock fencing. Suitable for keeping full grown sows contained, it wasn’t enough to keep the determined fox out and prevent the fox from taking 1 or 2 piglets away each night, leaving 1 or 2 dead piglets inside the pens with the sows each time also. Farmers don’t like spending money but those losses are unsustainable. The electric fence was a further security measure taken by the farmer.


    “Historically, the meaning of the word decimate is 'kill one in every ten of (a group of people)'. This sense has been more or less totally superseded by the later, more general sense 'kill, destroy, or remove


    A farmer needs to increase flock size annually and build on keeping breeding ewes. (Keep in mind a farmer needs to sell sheep from the flock) A fox that takes, injures, kills a lamb it is a loss to the flock. Any pregnant and then worried ewes risk loosing those lambs (it happens all too often) the public are constantly informed not to let dogs worry sheep. In fact a farmer can shoot to kill a dog not (under close control) found worrying sheep for this very reason, Again loss to the flock. If the loss is high enough over time their flock is decimated. From my experience working as a agricultural fencing contractor, often for sheep farmers and pig farmers. A fox will return night after night and try do do exactly the same, take by killing a vulnerable animal. Be that animal vunerable because it’s young, weak, remote, inadequately secured behind less substantial fencing (that’s a laugh) our Countryside is a patchwork of stone walls, hedgerows and stock fencing. All of those can be breached by a determined fox. Fields with public access have styles that not only the public can access but a able fox or dog. Farmers work on a small profit margin. When it comes to livestock. Small losses can be absorbed. A persistent fox will eventually be exterminated, unfortunately any fox within the area may also become a target by the same farmer.

  • Hello Sir,

    The farmer is to blame if he can't protect his animals properly! And there is a big difference between carrying a tiny piglet away, and 'decimating' a whole flock of sheep! If a fox gets into a chicken coop, the panic of the chickens overexcites a fox, and ends up as carnage. Again, it is the farmers fault for not providing safe housing!

    I think that's probably why someone said you talked nonsense, because it is!

    Interesting when we look at the alternatives, like factory style ‘housed’ animal husbandry. Or a landscape of stock proof field cages covering our green and pleasant land. Not to mention uplands, moorlands and heathlands that remain open access to the public and fencing out foxes to those areas would be a none starter. But Protection from predatory birds included (hence) the need to have a cadgemay be something in the future. (The increased population of Buzzards throughout The English Countryside) http://farmingforum.co.uk/foru…-Buzzards-attacking-lambs No I don’t believe Buzzards are a threat to the sheep farmers flocks. Just in case there’s a Troll in the neighbourhood. But with successive avian breeding and release programs, who is to say, the threat may become real with some of the bird species and just a part of farming life in a fruitful future.


    Has a horse owner, I was aware that it’s a property owners responsibility to fence out my horse, should my horse get free and decide to trample all over the property owners flower beds or graze their lawns. However it would become my responsibility to prevent my horse from straying if it happened a second time, because I would be assumed to know that it’s quite likely to happen again.


    I know that if farmers were to go the extra mile to fortify their land inc from above. There would be an outcry from the public on grounds of spoiling the landscape.


    Let’s face it. None of us will see a vegan world, not in our lifetime.


    So how far should a sheep farmer go to safeguard their flock and what is considered acceptable precautions/controls against loss from dogs, foxes, diurnal and nocturnal birds of prey (raptors) etc.

  • Alices Wonderland - Unfortunately, i agree that we will never see a Vegan world in our lifetime. This, to me, is heartbreaking. I just don't understand how people can continue to live with themselves knowing what an animal goes through just to satisfy a half hour of greed!

    Anyway, to go back on topic, Canada Goose will continue to be hassled, and rightly so! In this day and age there is no need for animals to be tortured for any clothing!

  • https://www.fginsight.com/news…ed-in-savage-attack-47574


    Man charged and dogs 'destroyed' after 37 lambs killed in savage attack

    Top Stories18 Dec 2017


    A man has been charged and two dogs ‘humanely destroyed’ after they attacked and killed 37 lambs on a farm.

    OPEN LETTER: Sheep worrying isn’t just a blood-stained rabid dog ripping livestock apart #TakeTheLead

    To see your livestock so traumatised and petrified, as a farmer, is both upsetting and makes your blood boil.


    Twice this year, in separate conversations, local people have told me with some amusement that their dog has chased my sheep.


    Only when they have seen my face have they realised that this isn’t actually funny.


    Are they stupid, heartless animal haters? I would like to think not - more in need of education.


    Facts

    • Running around barking at livestock with your tail up is worrying.
    • Chasing livestock in the form of a game is worrying.

    As an owner doing nothing about either of the above is a matter for the police.