My friend the Vegan..........

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  • My friend went from vegetarian to vegan in just less than a year ish ago. I have been supportive & inquisitive regarding this transformation and have listened to her without judgement.


    She is developing into a (for want of better expression and excuse my french) a complete and utter pain in the fucking arse!!!


    She is on a crusade and mission and even though everyone around her has supported her choice without judgement, she is beginning to make small judgements in my direction. She is turning into a keyboard pro vegan activist, with comments putting down others choices in life.


    We had a conversation last week where I tried to get her to see that while its great she has made this choice, it has to be for her and if she makes others think about making changes in her social circle then great, but she cannot berate the rest of us for our choices.


    How do I cope with this.. ?


    I happen to comment on FB the other night that I really enjoyed my dinner which was meat and she commented with a *sad* reaction..


    Now to me that is a tad invasive and not necessary to try to make me feel bad for my choices..


    Thoughts please ?

  • Firstly, this is the vegetarian/vegan support forum - not the place for meat eaters to argue or get permission to carry on with their choices. Therefore I may move this elsewhere, depending on how it goes and who benefits.


    But I hear you - it's pretty common for someone to wake up to the way humans treat animals, change their lifestyle, become really passionate - and then fail to understand why other people don't change with them. This "pushy" phase is usually stronger in the first year, and then followed by total disillusionment at humanity.


    Let's face it, humans are typically great at speaking out about how much they want love and peace and kindness, but not so great when it comes to demonstrating this with their actions.


    I have no problem with people stating their message vocally, it's a good message, it's a necessary message - it's passionate for a reason. But if it becomes to obsessive and accusatory it ends up alienating the people who would benefit from listening to it (pretty much everyone).


    It's only effective when people are receptive or when it's pertinent to the discussion. I have no problem with criticism, or poking people's consciences, but I don't think shaming does any good.


    Maybe watch / show her this and the videos it links to ...


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gN0HFTTrtr4

  • Thanks Paul.. am not trying to offend anyone and really do admire anyone who can make that leap/choice. I just wanted any advice from this side of the fence but perhaps this side of the fence is not the right place to find it?


    I have tried to tell her that not everyone is ready or realises changes at the same time and making someone feel rubbish is not a way to convert ..


    Sorry if I got this wrong..

  • As Paul said, she'll likely chill out with time so stick with her...passion can be annoying but is also to be admired as at least she gives a damn about something.


    For me, turning vegan was sort of a eureka moment....my thinking shifted and i suddenly realised how wrong i'd been. Is kind of like wakening up or coming out of a trance and it's really frustrating when you can't make other people understand. Is no different to the passion that most people feel when they see a dog or cat being abused..


  • It's times like this I seriously consider going vegetarian.


  • Ditch this person off your fb with immediate effect.


    Do what you want with your life & don't ever answer to anybody.


    She has crossed the line. Bin her & don't look back. She aint no friend.

  • As much as it pains me to say it :rolleyes: I think Paul has it spot on as per.


    It is a personal choice & there is a fine line between guidance & having it rammed down your throat.


    I read sensible posts here that do make me stop & ponder, but if I was ever attacked or made to feel guilty for eating meat then I'd just tell em to sod off, I wouldn't care who they were.
    If some bloody idiot decides I'm not worth the same air they breathe because I eat meat, then I'm not really gonna miss that person when I tell them to sod off.
    What would drive me nuts is some egomaniac trying to tell me what I could or couldn't do. I can think for myself & there is not a chance I would fall for emotional blackmail or bullying.
    Take that sad face she sent & shove it up her arse :)

  • Seriously though.. listening to what my friend is eating etc over last few months and given the diet I have been following.. sugar free (coughs) mostly recently lol.. no beans, pulses, grains, legumes, wheat or dairy and no processed foods.. what as a vegan would I eat?


    I dont believe in substituted stuff .. like sausages and the like.. Sausages are meat.. why invent something that resembles a meat product?


    My diet would be boring.. my friends diet is full of man made products probably full of additives, sugar and lots of fatty foods..


    I cant see how, after almost a year of paleo, that can actually be healthy?


  • Just let it go :D delete the friend & move on.

  • I dont believe in substituted stuff .. like sausages and the like.. Sausages are meat.. why invent something that resembles a meat product?

    It's not, it's just a convenient food shape that people have adopted. You could argue that we're making products to look like meat, but I'd argue that they're made to look less like meat...


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    shapes.jpg


    All a matter of perspective :p


    My diet would be boring.. my friends diet is full of man made products probably full of additives, sugar and lots of fatty foods..

    If you want to eat super-healthy on a vegan diet it's not too dissimilar to paleo anyway - just ditch the animal stuff and reintroduce the legumes. We get enough protein from vegetables and fruit anyway (gorillas are mostly frugivores)


    Besides, "paleo" refers to a period of a couple of million years; human diets varied greatly in that time, from scavenger to hunter gatherer depending on both climate and region - the paleo diet as popularised is largely incorrect, although there are definite health benefits for eating a more natural diet.


    It's late and I'm tired, but there are plenty of resources I can find, and hopefully some others will offer some inspiration too.


    Raw till 4 is one example.

  • I see your point CT.You can still be passionate about something,without trying to control everyone else!Now if I was your vegan friend,I probably would'nt even mention the fact I had turned vegan,unless it was called for.(Example,you had invited me over for dinner).I would probably invite you over for vegan meal,but would'nt mention it was vegan,and let the food do the talking!:D
    I gave up smoking just over a year ago.I don't care if people smoke or not,thats their choice,but I would'nt allow folk to smoke in my own house.I did'nt tell anyone either I was giving up initially.People at work noticed I was'nt heading outside for my usual smoke with them,and I told them I was having a break from smoking.I still dont smoke,but my point is,I don't preach to all and sundry who smoke about giving up.A few people at work have mentioned to me recently they're giving up,and its no big deal to me.If they need support or advice from me,they'll ask me lol I guess really thats what your friend should do,wait until someone asks them about turning veggie/vegan,and if no one asks?Its no big deal.

  • Yeah thats how I would be.. although she has spoken at length about it with me, which I dont mind really but basically about how difficult it can be being vegan out and about, eating out etc and just generally running things past me, I never ever saw it as a way to try to make me feel guilty or convert me, it was just general chat about being vegan and I supported her and listened because thats what I do.. until very recently.


    As you say, its like an ex smoker banging on and on.. noone is ever ready to make changes in their life when someone else is, its a personal time shift thing in themselves.


    I am sure she will calm down in near future as she gets to grip with it all herself. I really love her as a friend and I wouldnt want to spoil the friendship... am also damn proud of her for making a very difficult change in her life, especially as she has four kids to juggle too..


    I have days where I am vegetarian and dont eat meat.. so you could say I dip my toe in occasionally lol


    I see your point CT.You can still be passionate about something,without trying to control everyone else!Now if I was your vegan friend,I probably would'nt even mention the fact I had turned vegan,unless it was called for.(Example,you had invited me over for dinner).I would probably invite you over for vegan meal,but would'nt mention it was vegan,and let the food do the talking!:D
    I gave up smoking just over a year ago.I don't care if people smoke or not,thats their choice,but I would'nt allow folk to smoke in my own house.I did'nt tell anyone either I was giving up initially.People at work noticed I was'nt heading outside for my usual smoke with them,and I told them I was having a break from smoking.I still dont smoke,but my point is,I don't preach to all and sundry who smoke about giving up.A few people at work have mentioned to me recently they're giving up,and its no big deal to me.If they need support or advice from me,they'll ask me lol I guess really thats what your friend should do,wait until someone asks them about turning veggie/vegan,and if no one asks?Its no big deal.

  • As Emma said, going vegan is like a eureka moment, you suddenly see things differently. You then quickly get frustrated that others didn't have that moment of clarity. I understand the comparison to smoking etc but it's not the same, you smoke you hurt yourself, you eat meat & hurt animals.


    That said, shoving it down people's throats isn't helpful. Some people won't ever change, they'll just make excuses.


    Vegan food is as varied as you want it to be, almost any meal can be made vegan, add in a few herbs or spices to make it extra interesting. Pure meat meals tend to rely more upon the flavour of the meat while vegetarian ones tend to be more varied, the same meal can be a dozen different things by changing herbs & spices then popping it in a wrap, a taco shell, with rice or anything else.

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