What do this new law mean?

Welcome to UKHIppy2764@2x.png

UKHippy is a long running online community and of likeminded people exploring all interpretations on what it means to be living an alternative lifestyle -- we welcome discussions on everything related to sustainability, the environment, alternative spirituality, music, festivals, politics and more -- membership of this website is free but supported by the community.

  • The lie is only OK if it has no effect on the claim, if you tell the insurance company you live in a house and only holiday in the van when in actual fact you live in it full time then that changes the odds that that something will happen to it so it might still in validate the claim.


    If you told them you were full timing in it but also owned a property then that might be OK if it turned out you didn'town the property azs it's not relevant to a claim on the van as you told them you lived in it anyway.

  • What constitutes a ficticious address is the real question. Most people have an address of some description. My address is my mother's retirement flat :rolleyes: and I do officially live there. My doctor is registered there, so is my passport, drivers licence, insurance, bank account etc.

  • Id think ficticious is imaginary so if you say you live at number 30 and houses only go up to 20 it's an imaginary ( ficticious) address, problem being for them is they can't use it to contact you if you've broken the law or something. So as long as you use a real address they can use to contact /find you I believe you'd be ok.

  • I like to use my employers work address for insurance.


    There are very few vehicles registered to that postcode,
    so very few claims ever get made,
    so statistically it is a very, very safe place to have a vehicle.


    And I am contactable at that address. :)


    Reduces the premium.


    :beard:

  • Mine is up in October. Should be fun sorting that one out :rolleyes: I don't think.


    "Yeah it's the site next to the dog & duck pub, the one with the hanging baskets. If you go through the first field then chuck a right ...
    No noooo , that's the sister site! I'm the other side of the town ...


    Eh? Compooter said what? :eek:


    A pushbike you say?

  • I think it should be ok, it is your address (your post address) if they assume you sleep there that's their mistake


    I had a work colleague who lived above her moms pub, but the insurance if you live at a pub was double due to the risk increase.


    So she lied, said she lived at her dads house in the next road, they found out and had her premiums increased 3 fold as if she was an uninsured driver ( which is what they claimed she was by lying) and lost her no claim bonus.


    I have used my parents or brothers addresses for years, but as yet I have never had an at fault claim in nearly 30 years of driving, the issue has never come up.


    As regards the law change, if the premiums were the same as the fictitious address I suppose you could argue it was a collateral lie, but if you lie to get cheaper premiums, that wouldn't be a collateral lie anymore, but fraud.


  • Pushbike it is then :D


    At least it will keep me fit!

  • The one thing that would possibly be of benefit that i can think of is the 6 foot bed clause in my policy. I want a bed across the back of my sprinter, i arent 6 foot and dont need 6 foot but the insurance company has it as one of their requirements.
    If i fitted a 6 foot bed im either taking up loads of space, or messing about making it up - i dont want to do either.


    So, if i fitted a 5' 9" odd bed across the back, and told them it was 6 foot and then had an accident they couldnt wriggle out of paying by saying my bed doesnt comply.


    At least that is my interpretation of it - is that correct?

  • I really can't see that coming up, Rick, but I suppose yes, that Would be covered by the law change, you could also claim good faith, the DVLA made a mistake giving you a camper van V5 when the bed was too short. Most of the details you give to the insurance company are done in good faith. Have you ever measured the cc of the engine? You just go one the log book, but it could have an incorrect engine fitted that you did not know about. Good faith covers mistakes like that.

  • But on the list of requirements that i was given by the insurance company, one of the items was must have a bed minimum length 6 foot.
    Re DVLA - do they actually know what they are doing - if i sent a picture in of my bed with a tape measure next to it showing 6 foot is that good enough, or do they know you cant get a 6 foot bed across a sprinter?

  • That was my concern when i first looked into a bed across the back. How do people get round tbis issue?


    I cant see how they can dictate that standard in your policy.Very few light vans have a 6ft internal width so it would be impossible to fit one across the back.
    What happened to the definition of a motorhome conversion of a van or truck being that it must be impossible for the rear access to be used for loading goods...ie you had to build in a narrow door or seal up the rear end ..or has that all changed?


    As regards the white lie policy change i think its simply referring to points that would not have made any material outcome to the claim. False addresses are material because your policy is determined on postcode location and risk rate..sometimes thst can vary street by street within a postcode or per address if there sre higher thsn normal claims from an address,so if you give incorrect addresses your policy may be incorrectly quoted..the onus is on you to give the correct address.
    The fact you had your van sprayed black instead of dark blue is not a material fact in an accident claim....though it possbly might be if you chsnged a white van to nato green which is harder to see in poor light if the accident occurred at night and you hadnt told them of the change.


    In your bed case the fact that it was 5'9 not 6' and fitted length ways not accross would not be a material fact to a claim if the van was still incapable of being used as a comnercial vehicle because it had a bed and furniture fitted in it.


    If youre having hassle with the insurance company then find one thst has a realistic understanding of commercisl vans and motorhome conversions.
    One thing is certain,the insurance companies WILL use this as a reason to raise premiums...they always find a reason to, year after year.

  • The legal precedent would imply that an insurance company cannot use the fact that you lied to refuse a claim unless the lie materially relates to the circumstances of the claim, having said that if they do bounce your claim how many lawyers can you afford?

  • It was shield - link below. Flux also had the same requirement.


    http://www.shieldtotalinsuranc…ome-insurance/self-build/


    My initial thought was to build a bed across the back of the van 4 foot 6 wide same as a double, and make it with the ability to extend forward to make 6 foot length. I wouldnt use it like that, i would use it closed and sleep across van but the facility would be there and therefore requirement fullfilled. Just thought it might save some work if i could do without.

  • It was shield - link below. Flux also had the same requirement.


    http://www.shieldtotalinsuranc…ome-insurance/self-build/


    My initial thought was to build a bed across the back of the van 4 foot 6 wide same as a double, and make it with the ability to extend forward to make 6 foot length. I wouldnt use it like that, i would use it closed and sleep across van but the facility would be there and therefore requirement fullfilled. Just thought it might save some work if i could do without.


    Get a string hammock (they're over 6 foot long) and keep it handy in case of a claim.
    Insurance Condition satisfied, a six foot bed. Then sleep however you want to.
    Or have a 6' inflatable bed in a locker.


    James

  • It was shield - link below. Flux also had the same requirement.


    http://www.shieldtotalinsuranc…ome-insurance/self-build/


    My initial thought was to build a bed across the back of the van 4 foot 6 wide same as a double, and make it with the ability to extend forward to make 6 foot length. I wouldnt use it like that, i would use it closed and sleep across van but the facility would be there and therefore requirement fullfilled. Just thought it might save some work if i could do without.


    I had the stupid 'computer says no' off a few insurance companies over my LDV convoy being an ex post office 7 seater crew cab panel van(well it was until i took 4 out to make room for my dog crate).7 seats ?...'Not on the database' 'its non standard' 'its its its.... sorry we cant quote or cover it.
    Rang NFU 'no problem' me : but its got 7 seats ,NFU : And ? .... I had no problem either ,when i told them id removed 4 seats.


    All the others id been with expected me to have the bolt holes plated over making it impossible to refit the seats and the work would have to be verified by their inspector before theyd even quote me.
    NFU are not the bargain basement level in insurance premiums but not rip off either.I used to use flux lancaster and the other 'specialist' insurers for my landrovers and had no end of bickering with them over slightest alterations....cant be doing with that.I want affordsble cover not an ongoing Inquisition.

  • Get a string hammock (they're over 6 foot long) and keep it handy in case of a claim.
    Insurance Condition satisfied, a six foot bed. Then sleep however you want to.
    Or have a 6' inflatable bed in a locker.


    James


    bed has to be fixed although it can be convertible into seating or whatever to qualify as a motorhome conversion, i suspect if you have a bed AND a hammock they wont accept measurement of a hammock over measurement of a fixed bed.


    All this is a bit immaterial though unless something happens, i used to build custom cars and the insurance company are quite happy to take your word for it until something happens, then the assessor gets involved and you might get screwed over.


    remember its' not just about losing the value of your van, IF you get blamed for hitting another car and your insurance claim is refused you could be paying off a personal injury claim forever.


    IMO you do as you see fit, but always best to be armed with facts so you can make an informed choice, insurance assessors are not stupid, a roll away bed or hammock wont fool them when they can clearly see the vans main bed.

  • My experience of the NFU is that they will insure anything, especially if you have a track record with them. They recently bent their own rules a tad to cover my temporary car while I fix the bus. I think they are good. They aren't cheap, but dealing with the cheap companies (who are mostly operated by Admiral, it seems) is sheer misery. For example, if you have a policy with a cheapie it will probably cost you to exit partway through the year, same with Adrian Fux, lost patience with them years ago. NFU just charge you for the cover you use, no extra "admin" fees.


    But insurance is a silly price. It is a racket supported by government at every level.

  • Tried the NFU this morning. Self build camper? Dont really do them. If you want we can quote you once you provide engineers report and gas test certs.


    Politely declined.


    Sometimes with NFU it depends on who you deal with.The national office will give you cue card responses.If you deal with a local office they will usually spend time hunting round for cover.


    A-plan are another who will push the boat out to find you cover....sometimes Privelige will too though i havent dealt with them for a while.