Buy Land - for hippy camping site!

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  • Hi, Just wondered how many others on here would like to buy some land, and turn it into a hippy camp site.


    Maybe if there are enough of us, we could club together.
    Add you name to the list including an area you'd like to do this in:


    List
    BoxVan - Dorset, Somerset, Wales, Cornwall and Devon.

  • Wow, 50k would be a grand start!


    But most people will not have this amount. So how about 1k/2k minimum. With a group of people, it will soon build up.


    Work on site can be done by members with the skills, building, gardening, admin, accounts, organising, cooking... all skill sets welcomed!


    Open to suggestions from all regarding the best way to go!

  • I have read that if your campsite becomes part of the Caravan Club, you get to bypass planning rules.


    Taken from wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Caravan_Club


    A Certificated Location (or 'CL') is an informal privately-owned caravan site for up to 5 caravans in the United Kingdom. Visitors with caravans pay a small fee to the CL owner in order to pitch overnight. This is usually cheaper than larger commercial caravan sites. There are about 2500 CLs in the UK and are for exclusive use by Caravan Club members. Each year the Caravan Club issues a Certificate to those sites that continue to meet their standards, hence 'Certificated Locations'. Caravan Club members vote annually for the best Certificated Location in the 'CL of the Year' competition [4].



    Most CLs are in the countryside, they are individually owned and can be on a farm or smallholding, on spare land next to a pub, golf course or hotel or on land attached to the owner's house. CLs need no site licence or formal planning permission, but are covered by two Acts of Parliament:


    The laws state that visitors with caravans must be members of The Caravan Club, who are required to act responsibly and to observe the Country Code and no more than 5 caravans may be accommodated on the site at any one time. Caravan may not stay for more than 28 days per visit and must be occupied overnight. CLs are for recreational purposes and only touring caravans, motor caravans or trailer tents are permitted - tents are not permitted, other than attached caravan awnings, toilet tents or small pup tents; and permanently-sited (static) caravans are not permitted on the same landholding.



    There are also a number of guidelines stated. For example CLs should be fairly level and have at least ½ acre of land; and have safe access for caravans including 12ft wide gateway and safe approach road. If the landowner has a caravan site licence from their Local Authority, the Caravan Club is unlikely to issue a Certificate, unless the CL is entirely separate from the landowner's other business activities.



    To become a CL, owners should provide an emptying point for chemical closets; a safe drinking water supply; A bin for dry rubbish; and public liability insurance cover. Some owners provide optional extras such as electrical hook ups, showers and toilets. Although exempt from planning permission, CL owners are liable to pay business rates and income tax on their profits.

  • The thing is, if it's a CL site, then that limits the amount of people who are joining in, and therefore the amount of money you have to buy the land with.


    Unless it was on a sort of time share thing where ten people put the money in and each got six months, or 20 people each got 3 months.

    “Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.” -Mark Twain

  • It wouldnt allow permanent residency for even one of the part owners. 28 day rule would apply. CL have like it says, have rules and award a certificate. I can't see them issuing one to a few hippies who don't really have any public camping, other than the few investors. Then theres the hippy/people politics and insurance/ rates so on so forth

  • When I say part shares, I don't mean to use all at once, but spread out throughout the year. Obviously the 28 day rule would apply, but that's easy to get around by having a layby down the road you pull on to once a month.


    I have often wandered about doing this, and I reckoned the easiest way would be to get a really straight respectable member of the community, with hippie tendencies, to represent the group and make it look like just a regular campsite application. But just don't advertise it anywhere. The site would probably not be full all year round just with its owners, so any empty spots can be let out to hippies for a small sum, but enough to cover public liability insurance, etc.


    I think this would be the closest way possible to a legal site and if I should ever come into some money this is what I would be most lively to do with it.

    “Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.” -Mark Twain

  • I have nearly finished reading a book about Off Grid living by Nick Rosen. It has a lot of info at the end on the legal issues. http://www.amazon.co.uk/How-Li…-Nick-Rosen/dp/0553818198
    I found it quite interesting and gave me some pointers for my daydreams which one day will become reality... one day.

    Through violence you may solve one problem, but you will sow the seeds for another...

  • I have spoken to Nick Rosen before. His website can be found at: http://www.off-grid.net/


    Maybe a few campsites across the country would be a way to go. Then you can travel from one to the next every 28 days. A hippy co-op.


    StarDust - Would you like to add your name and desired areas to the list?


    List
    BoxVan - Dorset, Somerset, Wales, Cornwall and Devon.

  • In theory I would like to, but i'm never going to have that much money so I wont! I have often thought a few hippie CL sites across the country would be ideal.

    “Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.” -Mark Twain

  • im with stardust on this one, a few sites across the country would be fantastic and im kinda interested but before i commit to anything at all im going to have to go and do some serious research. she is right about needing someone 'normall' for less than a better word who can set it up as a propper site.

    i like the idea of a nationwide hippy co-op, a sort of super fulid comunity but im not sure there are really enough of us to be able to aford one plot, let alone enough plots for everyone to have a place to stay and to allow the public spots in order to keep the caravan club happy.

    boxvan have you seen any sites that could work? if so how expensive are they? is this going to set this up as a business with equal partners?

    i admit i knew nothing about caravan club and the exemptions they have, i have always stayed away from them and there huge white motorhomes.

  • My grandparents have about 20acres up in these 'ere hills of Westerly Wales (used to have sheep and cattle but they just rent it to another farmer nowadays) and it's occasionally crossed my mind that if one day the land was passed to me that I'd use it as a casual hippy campsite. Not sure what the locals would say mind, especially the village Patriarch (tad Victorian, millionaire, will probably leave everything to the church when he goes :eek:) :D :D

  • claire apparently the 28 day rule is all you are allowed on one site for a whole year. i not looked into it, someone said so at college and it was someone who would be very knowledgeable about these things. but im sure theres lots of "normal" people who like keep caravans on a site and go visit them like for lots of random weeks over a summer and im sure would be more than 28 days so this rule confuses me muchly.


    i think this is a great idea and a shame its so complicated/expensive to do

  • The 28 day rule for campsites and the 28 day rule for regular fields are different. You can camp 28 days a year on a field with out CL or campsite status. You can camp all year round on a field with CL status or campsite planning permission, but never for more than 28 days in one go. It is legal, on a site with pp to stay on it as long as you want providing you pull off every 28 days and park back up in a different space.

    “Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.” -Mark Twain

  • Hi again,


    I am very glad some of you think this is a good idea. If we all keep adding our thoughts/ideas/research then we could end up getting a hippy camp site for real.


    Points to note:


    Land: The price of agricultural land does vary across the country - roughly from 2k an acre upwards - Depending on the area.
    Price increases can be for any building already on the land, possibly water and electric supplies connected, main road access (rather than country lanes). Natural springs, or river boundary, condition of land, woodland areas.



    Alices Wonderland is correct by saying that permanent residency is not allowed on the land. I suggest we swap with each every 28 days to get around this. I do not know how this is monitored, you may get 30 days or 32! I do not expect a council or caravan club staff to check very often. Although I could be wrong. I think that Stardust may also be correct, if after 28 days you move off site for 1 night, you can then move back on the next night to restart another 28 days. More research should be done on this.



    Welshie: Welcome on board - Any research you offer would be gratefully accepted, you need not commit but please do bring your findings to the virtual table for discussion and provoking the next steps. In answer to your question "is this a business with equal partners", I am not sure but happy for people to chip in with ideas. Maybe it is a not-for-profit organisation or a Ukhippy Club. Maybe people pay twenty quid a year to join, and then they can stay on different sites across the country for minimal fees/work/help? Some blue sky thinking i know, but at twenty quid each and 8,357 members on this site, that's 167,140 pounds a year - towards creating more sites and a nationwide hippy co-op, super fulid comunity.


    Welcome Noctula, Sunshine and Co, Hannah.


    Hannah, if it is complicated, we can work together to understand it. Please do ask your friend to join - his knowledge maybe just what we're after.


    I myself am looking into how long a period, each year that a CL site needs to be open to CL members. I am sure I have read somewhere that the period can be as little as 2 weeks of the year. What happens after that I am not sure.


    What skill sets do you all have.
    Maybe this would also be a good bit of knowledge we could add to this thread.


    Any other thoughts or suggestions from people would be inspiring.


    Thanks: Boxvan

  • I gave to confess, I have broken the 28 day rule many a time and never even come close to being caught. It doesn't seem to be very strictly enforced.

    “Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.” -Mark Twain

  • I think that the idea is sound in theory, and am sure that with enough research it could be made to work.


    Am not sure why you wish to go the Caravan club route to be honest - they will send inspectors, have rules, expect members to be able to stay etc.
    If the laws exist for them to have sites, the laws must be the same for Joe public (or even Joe Hippy). As such I think it would be better, and I would suggest very important, to keep away from other peoples clubs and their rules.
    By all means establish your own agreed conditions, but i would expect the requirements of Hippies to be somewhat different to the requirements of Caravan club members - I use their sites quite a lot, and often the members are really looking for, and expecting, all the comforts of home. Whilst i am aware that a CL site is very different to a full club run site, Rules is rules.


    I would certainly be interested in looking into this further, but to be 100% honest the geographic location i would require would very likely be to expensive. We all live in our wagons for different reasons.


    That said, would be happy to volunteer for weekend working parties etc regardless of whether i was intending to use the site.


    :-)

  • I would certainly be interested in looking into this further, but to be 100% honest the geographic location i would require would very likely be to expensive. We all live in our wagons for different reasons.


    That said, would be happy to volunteer for weekend working parties etc regardless of whether i was intending to use the site.


    :-)


    Welcome Colin M - Thanks for your comments. I am at work right now so this is only a quick reply. Can I ask which geographical location you would be interested in?


    Cheers - BoxVan

  • To the south of London - As I said it's not really that practical. I'd have to be in commuting distance to Kingston. There are campsites i use, but the land round this area is VERY expensive.

    :-)

  • I think the reasoning behind going the caravan club route is because it is so simple to get permission. You have a notice on the field for 28 days saying this is what you're planning, and if no one objects, you have permission. If you were to just be a regular campsite the planning permission and regulations are far more awkward and expensive.

    “Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.” -Mark Twain

  • fair comment - but don't the club want some form of payment for you to be one of their sites - per pitch or similar - i must read the link - will do so as soon as I get a chance!

    :-)

  • I know. Obviously people staying would have to join, but it's £30 a year and you get quite a few benefits for that. Plus you can stay on other CL sites which tend to be very quiet and tucked away.

    “Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.” -Mark Twain

  • Ah, eutopia - where do I sign?
    I wonder why andy and I never thought of this before - oh wait, we did - lots.
    If you can make it happen I'd sell my granny to be in on it.
    Good luck.
    Love and light x

  • You'd be better off selling andy. Much stronger and more useful than grannies!

    “Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.” -Mark Twain