leaving age moves to 17 today!

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  • ridiculous... it means those not suited to school will have to waste another year of their life when they could be getting into things such as apprenticeships.


    leaving school at 16 was one of the best things I have ever done!

  • yes n no.. there is EMA and also with them puttin the age up it means that child benefit will get paid for longer across the board...

  • Quote from Naeni

    ridiculous... it means those not suited to school will have to waste another year of their life when they could be getting into things such as apprenticeships.


    leaving school at 16 was one of the best things I have ever done!


    Quote from BBC News

    Children starting secondary school in England this week will be the first to be legally required to stay in education until they're 17. They will be given the option of studying for vocational diplomas instead of GCSEs and A levels.


    If this is implimented properly I see no real problem with it.. The leaving age is 17/18 in many other counties... But we have seen massive changes to our education sytem already... and they have not improved the system we have.. fingers crossed that his reform is a good one!

  • Quote from tekno

    If this is implimented properly I see no real problem with it.. The leaving age is 17/18 in many other counties... But we have seen massive changes to our education sytem already... and they have not improved the system we have.. fingers crossed that his reform is a good one!


    It just says education there, does it mean school or would college count?

  • Quote from Naeni

    It just says education there, does it mean school or would college count?


    Quote from BBC News

    The change will not mean that pupils have to stay in the classroom, but they will have to continue to receive training.


    I guess that means college would count... But it would be compulsory which it is not atm.. But you woulld have known all this if you had read the article yoursinuk had posted! :p:D

  • It will mean that if you go to college at sixteen because you want to you'll be stuck with all the others who'd rather be working in tesco. One of the biggest differences between school and college for me was that we all CHOSE to go there because we wanted to learn, it reflected in the whole atmosphere of the place and the staff. And yeah, a temporary blip in the unemployment figures, in an election year by any chance, during a recession?

  • Quote from julianthegypsy

    And yeah, a temporary blip in the unemployment figures, in an election year by any chance, during a recession?


    My thoughts exactly, Cynical? Me?:DSeems to me that some kids have trouble staying at school 'til they're 16, why should we force another year on them?
    Apprentiships are a good way forward.

  • Quote from julianthegypsy

    It will mean that if you go to college at sixteen because you want to you'll be stuck with all the others who'd rather be working in tesco. One of the biggest differences between school and college for me was that we all CHOSE to go there because we wanted to learn, it reflected in the whole atmosphere of the place and the staff.

    Although, I think there's been quite a move towards this happening anyway, starting even before I went into the sixth form (which was :eek: 19 years ago).

    When I went into sixth form, I think well over half the year group did. A few years earlier, it had been a much smaller proportion - generally just people who wanted to be there do A-levels and were usually intending to go to Uni - but when my sister reached the same stage (4 years after me), I think almost everyone stayed on. The School's figures bore this out too, and they began struggling to find room to accomodate all the extra people.

    There were quite a lot of people at sixth form in my year who said that the only reason they'd come back after GCSEs was because they couldn't find a job. One of the people who did leave at 16 got an apprenticeship, and initially thought what he was doing was a better option than staying on to do A-levels (or one of the few vocational courses that were offered at the time). However, once his apprenticeship finished, he changed his mind, as he then couldn't find work - being time-served made him too expensive to employ.

    I went to the sixth form attached to my secondary school, though, I don't know if it would have been different at a seperate college.

    I guess what I'm trying to say is, that it seems to me as though this is what has tended to be happening anyway, but maybe it's just being more formalised now.

  • annie that might be more indicative of qualifications being worth less these days, they're definitely getting easier.

  • That might well be part of it. I do remember though that there were quite a lot of people I went to sixth form with who were just there 'cos they felt they didn't have an alternative, not 'cos it was where they wanted to be.

  • yeah that's probably quite a strong factor, lots of people i went to school with only went to uni becuase it seemed they had nowt else to do

  • Quote from AnnieAnne

    That might well be part of it. I do remember though that there were quite a lot of people I went to sixth form with who were just there 'cos they felt they didn't have an alternative, not 'cos it was where they wanted to be.


    This is certainly the case in third world countries, more and more people stay on in education cos they can't find anything else to do. Ironically this means that anyone who has spent years in education is likely to be unemployable as otherwise they would have got through their exams and got a job. Millions of people in Indonesia do this, they don't ever get chucked out of uni for failing so they just stay there for years, or go to one of the dozens of less reputable uni's and end up with a worthless degree. Trying to find a skilled technician is a nightmare, they're gold dust and you have to wade through a million cv's to find one. They get paid well too (quite rightly). Fortunately for them the average Indonesian is more of a snob that the brits and everyone aims for a job in the civil service. Why that would be something to be proud of is beyond me.

  • Quote from julianthegypsy

    One of the biggest differences between school and college for me was that we all CHOSE to go there because we wanted to learn, it reflected in the whole atmosphere of the place and the staff.


    Thats been totally eradicated now as a lot of kids just stay on to claim their 30 quid a week EMA and "have a laugh". The alternative for them is to be sat at home doing nothing with no money. When they leave college they get a dole upgrade to 45 quid a week!

  • Quote from mellowguy

    Thats been totally eradicated now as a lot of kids just stay on to claim their 30 quid a week EMA and "have a laugh". The alternative for them is to be sat at home doing nothing with no money. When they leave college they get a dole upgrade to 45 quid a week!


    dammit don't get me started on EMA!

  • *sighs* the best thing about being in 6th form was that the half of the year who made school a misery buggered off and got jobs.

    A levels are hard, no matter what people say about them getting easier, and theyre not for everyone, which is fair enough. but forcing people to stay on at school 6th forms to do other more vocational subjects will be more of a stuggle on schools and i fear the more traditional stuff will get forgotton about. these new courses being offered at colleges is great i reckon, because theyre have more of an adult, business like approach to education, but i dont think many school 6th forms would cope with another offering an extra compulsory year of education with all different sorts of courses running at the same time and still maintain a decent standard.

    my brother started secondary school today (theres a big age gap) and he'll be one of the first that will now have to stay until he's 17. its yet to be seen if hes academically gifted or whatnot, so i dont know whether he'd stay on post 16 anyway, but for example, he loves cooking, and under new rules he wouldnt be able to leave at 16 and do a catering apprentiship.

    and yeah, as another bitter non EMA reciever, i can say that i fully resented the people who shuffled in late for their lectures, clutching their starbucks coffees with their apathetic expressions and who got paid to do nothing. :whistle:

  • Quote from Pixie

    *sighs* the best thing about being in 6th form was that the half of the year who made school a misery buggered off and got jobs.


    My opinion of further education is that the people who are there are there because they want to be there and all the troublemakers have left.


    That said I had a bad experience in school and lost all faith in education at the time. Looking back I wished i'd stayed on.


    Im not sure whether making kids stay on longer is a good idea at all, it just means more hassle for those who are acctually learning.


    As I said I left as soon as I could so i'm probably talking out of my uneducated ass

  • Quote from Pixie



    my brother started secondary school today (theres a big age gap) and he'll be one of the first that will now have to stay until he's 17. its yet to be seen if hes academically gifted or whatnot, so i dont know whether he'd stay on post 16 anyway, but for example, he loves cooking, and under new rules he wouldnt be able to leave at 16 and do a catering apprentiship.


    Quote from bbc news

    The rise in the leaving age is part of a previously announced government policy to have pupils continue in some form of education or training education to the age of 18. This will take effect for school leavers from 2015... The change will not mean that pupils have to stay in the classroom, but they will have to continue to receive training...


    I think that your brother would have the choice in doing a catering diploma if that is what he wanted... I also think that no one would be forced into doing A levels if that is not what they wanted to do... What is being amended is the age of leaving school... not limiting the choices of people or forcing them to be academic when they are not. The article posted in the OP and various other news articles give a really detailed account of what new diplomas will be on offer... And personally I think that making kids leave school at 17 is not THAT much of an issue... it happens in a lot of European countries... and other parts of the world...

  • Just rebel kids, check out your human rights and I think you will discover a right to self determination somewhere. I.E. YOU choose what YOU want to do! I would not credit anybody with the right to be able to tell you how to spend your time once you are over 16.


    And I'm speaking as a parent here.

  • Hmm ..... So the ' Kids " have to stay at School till 17 .....let me guess ..then do 2 Years Military Service or go to Prison ?

  • Quote from tekno

    I think that your brother would have the choice in doing a catering diploma if that is what he wanted... I also think that no one would be forced into doing A levels if that is not what they wanted to do... What is being amended is the age of leaving school... not limiting the choices of people or forcing them to be academic when they are not. The article posted in the OP and various other news articles give a really detailed account of what new diplomas will be on offer... And personally I think that making kids leave school at 17 is not THAT much of an issue... it happens in a lot of European countries... and other parts of the world...



    ahh, s'all good, i speed-read the article :o my bad.

    someone i know said that if everyone is educated to a higher standard, the standard is depriciated seeing as everyone has the same... so is it really worth it? employers will still be looking for 'extras' in interviews, so will it just become the new 'leave at 16' level? i didnt know whether to agree or not. im in mixed minds about this really.

  • Quote from Pixie



    someone i know said that if everyone is educated to a higher standard, the standard is depriciated seeing as everyone has the same... so is it really worth it? employers will still be looking for 'extras' in interviews, so will it just become the new 'leave at 16' level? i didnt know whether to agree or not. im in mixed minds about this really.


    But not everyone would be getting the same kind of education would they..? From what I understand about this is the aim is to ensure ALL 17 year old's have a higher level of training in their chosen field.. some kids will have more practical qualification and others will be more academic...


    I also don't know if this change in school leaving age will have a positive effect upon the level of education of school leavers... But at the same time I do not think this change is as controversial as say SAT's or the many changes to the school curriculum... or the lack of funding that affects *most* schools in this country...

  • Quote from tekno

    But not everyone would be getting the same kind of education would they..? From what I understand about this is the aim is to ensure ALL 17 year old's have a higher level of training in their chosen field.. some kids will have more practical qualification and others will be more academic...

    I also don't know if this change in school leaving age will have a positive effect upon the level of education of school leavers... But at the same time I do not think this change is as controversial as say SAT's or the many changes to the school curriculum... or the lack of funding that affects *most* schools in this country...



    yeah, fair point. ;)

    i guess it is just as controversial as when it went from 15 to 16.